Today is December the 17th, 2002. I am interviewing veteran Conrad A. Groseclose, or Bud. His date of birth is 11/9/26; address, 4591 Camborne Drive, Carmel, Indiana, 46033; place of birth, Indianapolis, Indiana. Bud was in the Army Air Corps in a training division, highest rank, private. His dates of enlistment, January_7, '44, to December_7, '45, and he served in World War II. My name is Leslie Reser. I am with Senator Lugar's office, and I will be conducting the interview. Bud, were you drafted or did you enlist?

No, I enlisted.

You enlisted. Where were you living at the time?

Mount Comfort, Indiana.

And why did you join?

Well, first of all, I wanted to learn to fly. I don't know that that's number one, but that was very important to me, and the fact that we were in a war, and I thought it was my duty to be a part of it.

And which branch of service did you join?

The Army Air Corps.

Do you recall your first days in the service?

Yes. I spent several months at Clemson College in South Carolina in an ASTRP program. Having been raised as a farm kid in a little town, I had never been away from home, and it was a rather shocking experience to go to a strange place and not know anybody.

Uh-hum.

But, it ended up working out fine.

What kind of training program was it?

It was a specialized training program for air cadets.

Okay. And how long were you there?

I was there until February of 1945 I do believe.

What kind of things did you learn there? Was it a kind of a boot camp?

No, no, it was strictly a college program, advanced program. We took like 30 college hours in three months, every three months. It was very, very highly specialized in such things as math, physics, chemistry, which I must admit I failed, having never had chemistry before that school.

That's a tough one. It is.

It was for me. But, that was the program.

Do you remember any of your instructors or any of the folks you went through this program with?

Oh, I had a very close friend, Jim Dooley, from Wallen, Indiana. We used to converse. I haven't seen him now in years, but he was best man at my wedding after the war was over.

Was he?

I remember Captain Earnesty (ph), who was our commander, and the head of the school -- it was a military school -- the head of the school was Colonel Cunningham. Why I remember all those, I don't know, but I do. That's_...

So you went into the Air Corps January_7, '44?

Right.

And, you stayed at Clemson for about three months you thought?

No, no. I was there -- We took 30 hours of class every three months.

Okay.

I was there until February.

Until February.

Of the following year.

And what was the ultimate goal then at the end of this? That you would fly?

Yes. Yes.

Did you actually do any air hours? Were you actually flying planes?

Not there, no. The closest airfield was at Greenville, South Carolina, and we would go over there occasionally, but the only flying I attempted to do was on New Year's Eve of 1944-45. We were going to go with a crew to Bermuda. We got to the end of the runway in a B-25 and lost oil pressure, so we taxied back to the hangar and I spent New Year's Eve in Greenville. It wasn't what I had in mind at all.

So World War_II is going on at this time.

Yes.

And, but you never got to go overseas or see any action?

No.

Did the war end? Is that what happened?

We went from there to Texas, to -- and I think I told you Wichita Falls. It was in Wichita Falls, but the airfield was Shepherd Field, and the war ended in Europe about that time, and I can't be exact on the date, but in any event, we got the sad news that those of us who had not gotten as far as advanced training in the air program were going to be washed out of the cadet program. So, from there I went to Lowry Field to gunnery school. It was the closest thing I could get to flying without being in a cockpit.

Yeah. How long was gunnery school?

Oh, my, two months or abouts.

Lowry Field you said was in Colorado.

Yes, in a suburb of Denver. Not there anymore.

Tell me a few of your most memorable experiences. I like the story you just told about New Year's Eve.

Oh, my. Well, I guess no reflection on Clemson, I have been back to visit since then and it's changed considerably, but it was strictly a military school, and I wasn't too fond of the people who were going there that went into the service, but having been raised on a farm where our food was the best, to go to a school like that where -- bear with me -- the floor would be covered at night with cockroaches. It was horrible. It was dirty. The food was lousy. We got a lot of grits. Three meals a day we were served grits. I went from 170 pounds -- and I was not fat -- to when I left service I weighed 125.

Wow.

And I attributed most of it to --

The grits?

-- the food at Clemson. The grits.

We Hoosiers are used to grits, aren't we?

No. I can eat them today.

You eat them?

Oh, yes I do. I eat grits with butter, salt and pepper. And I couldn't do it for years. Another -- Most of the things are going to be food experiences, but Texas, our favorite food was Diablo stew, and it was made with mutton.

Oh, really.

And I will not touch a piece of lamb anymore because of that. I mentioned my friend Jim Dooley who, as I say, I haven't seen in years now, and it's my fault. Well, his too. We just don't do it. But, he and I were together almost entire military career.

Were you?

We went to Clemson together. We didn't know each other before. We went to Clemson before. He was a farm kid, also. We both played basketball in high school. We played at Clemson. We taught some of the southerners how to fast break, that they didn't know how to do. But, he went to Texas with me, and then from there -- he was also in the cadet program -- from there we went to Colorado together, and we separated at that point because he went into -- why, I don't know -- he went into photography school, which I mean, it's fine if that's what he wanted to do, but I could not quite understand that. But, as I say, after the war, after I married and he married, we just kind of drifted apart, so ...

How did you keep in touch with your family while you were away from Indiana?

Primarily by letter.

Uh-hum.

We lived in a little community that had very poor telephone service. Not because of the operator, because the lady who ran the switchboard in Mount Comfort, which was a little house no bigger than this one, was my sister, my older sister.

Oh, really.

So when I would call home, I would not only get to talk to my parents, but I could also talk to her, because she stayed in on the phone conversation.

I see.

But it was seldom we talked by phone. It was mostly by letter.

Mostly by letter. Did you know your wife prior to going into the service?

Yes, I did. I dated her before I went in the service.

So you must have kept in touch with her, too, then.

Yes, I did. In fact, I farmed her parents' farm before I went in the service.

I see.

That's how we met.

I see. So, how did you entertain yourselves? You talked about basketball.

Well, there wasn't much entertainment at Clemson, so I won't mention that. At Shepherd Field, there wasn't much there, either. Wichita Falls -- and I have been through there many times since then going to California, and it has grown considerably and it's a very nice little city, but when I was there, there was only one tree between the air base and the town.

One tree?

One tree. There was mesquite, which is a little bush about so big, but as far as a tree like we are used to here, only one. Didn't go to town very often. And, Denver, I became permanent party, which I was a permanent fixture on the field, if I may use that terminology, so I could come and go as I pleased. And of course we didn't make much, 50 bucks a month, so I worked part time as a bowling alley pin boy. You know, I worked for a while, then bowled for a while.

Bowled for a while.

Yeah. So that was the main thing that we did.

Did you continue to bowl after the service?

Very much so, yeah. In fact, at one point I considered turning pro.

Did you really.

Uh-hum, but couldn't afford it.

Uh-huh.

Plus, I had a family to support at the time, so ...

Right. So, do you recall the day your service ended?

Well, yes. It was Pearl Harbor day.

Yes.

So, it was the day that I will never forget for many reasons, but --

But you knew you were getting out?

Yes. I was supposed to get out earlier, and my folks' house burned down and my mother was injured with smoke inhalation, and so the Red Cross gave me an emergency leave, so I came home on leave in November, and Jim Dooley was discharged while I was home, so I went back and was discharged a little later.

I see.

But --

Well, that must have been traumatic.

Yes, it was.

To have your home burn down.

Yes, it was.

So what did you do in the days and weeks afterwards then when you were discharged?

Well, I came home and I went to work. I didn't know about the 52/20 club. You probably never heard of that.

What's the 52/20 club? I haven't heard it referred to as that anyway.

Well, it was a 52/20 club, and it was for veterans -- they should never have done it -- but it was for veterans. They could draw $20 a week for 52 weeks without working.

Okay.

Which is ridiculous. But, I didn't know about it, so I didn't draw it. My parents at that point were living in Indianapolis after the fire, and sold the farm and so forth, assuming I would not farm afterwards, which they were right, I wouldn't. So, I went to work for a machinery company called McQuay-Norris. I don't even know that it's still there. It was on Massachusetts Avenue. Worked there for a short while. Wasn't the thing to do. So then I went to work at Fort Harrison, at their disciplinary barracks, and following that back to school.

You used the GI Bill then?

Yes, I did.

Did your schooling that you did at Clemson help you in any way?

Yes, it did to a point, yeah, because there were many courses I didn't have to take.

Okay.

That, and I didn't attempt to take chemistry.

I don't blame you. I don't blame you.

And unfortunately I never finished. I got sick and had to quit school, and so I didn't finish.

Where did you go to school?

Indiana.

Indiana University?

Yeah. Indianapolis campus.

Got you.

Which was on -- at that time, on East Michigan Street.

Okay.

Between Pennsylvania and Delaware.

Okay.

But -- and I have been sorry on occasion that I didn't finish, but that's a long time ago.

Uh-hum.

I am not worried about it now. So, then I went to work for Indiana Bell and was there 39 years.

Were you?

Yeah.

Uh-hum. Very good. How did your service and your experiences affect your life? Were you glad you had that year?

Oh, yes. Almost two years; 23 months.

Okay.

The old saying, I wouldn't give a nickel to do it again, but I wouldn't give a million dollars for not having the experience. It makes you grow up. I am not sure, I have got three grandsons, none of which -- none of whom are old enough to go in the service yet, but I don't think it would hurt any of them. I don't think it hurts anybody. I really don't.

What kind of things does it teach you?

How to do things on your own, you don't have to rely on people. I don't mean that in the wrong way, because I was a manager for many, many years, and I had to rely on my people. They have to do the job for you.

Right. Right.

But, you know, it teaches you a degree of independence, and tells you a little bit about life.

Uh-hum. Probably teaches you discipline.

Oh, no question about that, yeah. Sure does, yeah.

Yeah. Was there anything else that we haven't covered that you would like to talk about?

I can't think of anything. My service was, you know, not very_colorful.

Well, like you said, it made a difference in your life.

Absolutely.

You were part of the whole picture.

I probably would have ended up being a poor farmer out in Hancock County had I not gone in the service, had there not been a war, but ...

Kind of opened up your view of the world a little more?

Yeah, I think so. And I think of my brother, who is older than I was, who tried to get in the service and was unable to because he had very bad eyes, and I think it affected him the wrong way, you know. He took a very sour look on things. His entire life was -- I mean, he was successful, but he was also miserable, and --

You think that had something to do with it?

Oh, I am sure it did. I am sure it did, yeah. And perhaps some, too, our lack of relationship, because I wouldn't say it was jealousy, but it could be.

You experienced something that he couldn't.

That's right.

Yeah.

So, as I say, I wouldn't have given it up for anything, and I think many, many boys ought to do it. And today girls, too. Sorry.

I would agree with you.

Yeah.

I appreciate your time today, and taking time to record your story --

No problem, such as it is.

-- and helping with the Veterans History Project. Thank you very much.

(End of interview.)